Talk:Soy boy

	This Conspiracy related article has been awarded BRONZE status for quality. It's getting there, but could be better with improvement. See RationalWiki:Article rating for more information.

Bronze?

Pls? oʇɐʇoԀʇɐϽʎzznℲ (talk/stalk) 05:10, 27 November 2017 (UTC)

I assume you mean silver since it already is bronze? CowHouse (talk) 05:16, 27 November 2017 (UTC)

If soy does lower testosterone / increase estrogen

Then how come women are prescribed birth control pills to boost estrogen if they have high testosterone / low estrogen from polycystic ovarian syndrome rather than have doctors make them eat soy? Why is PcOS from low estrogen even a thing (moreso, the most common endrocrine disorder in women) if society is being more feminine? --It's-a me, LeftyGreenMario! 00:49, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

Seems to be more than a few. If you search "pcos and soy", you'll find some results touting benefits of soy, though I remain skeptical of those sites because they're often spouting advice on not eating GMO foods. I think this is important to go into the article nevertheless. But anyone who's more familiar with diving into research can possible contribute? This might be interesting.

Some results:

• http://www.pcosnutrition.com/soy/
• https://pcos.com/soy-and-pcos/
• http://www.pcosgirl.com/pcos-and-soy/ (blog post about soy helping with PCOS, take with a grain of salt)
• https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3214337/ (study study; smallish sample size of 146 people, quasi-randomized, doubleblinded, placebo controlled)

--It's-a me, LeftyGreenMario! 21:36, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

The only statistical study you got here is a mixed bag at best, and shows next to nothing relevant to this conspiracy theory either way. The experimental group had marginally higher testosterone than control group at initial testing, and higher than control group at follow up, but a gap that shrunk trivially. Also they studied women with ovary issues. Also they used purified phytoestrogens administered regularly. There's a tendency, when we look for contrary or supporting studies to take anything that addresses the question at all, and to take them even if they don't adequately control for the variables in question. Sorry to only offer criticism, but I just don't want to include a source of questionable relevance. ikanreed ^{🐐Bleat at me} 21:44, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

Well, my primary intent was to open eyes to a new perspective on this issue. I thought the study was relevant because soy supposedly influences men's testosterone/estrogen and I was wondering why there isn't discussion for women who actually do have high testosterone/ low estrogen imbalance (a symptom/indicator of PCOS; and I was diagnosed with it only because a blood sample showed my having those abnormal ratios, and I was given birth control rather than being advised to eat soy). I primarily wanted to invite criticism and comments because I wasn't certain or confident about the information otherwise, hence I shared it on the talk page rather than posting it in the article. I do think it's worth pointing out that side of the coin because as far as I know, men and women metabolize pretty much the same way. That being said, if the study doesn't actually address the soy diet for women with PCOS (the subset of PCOS women with hormone imbalance like I have), then it isn't relevant. It doesn't seem that way because you said women received purified phytoestrogens. If you do find more appropriate studies, then that would be great. I'm not particularly good at diving through ncbi or those things. --It's-a me, LeftyGreenMario! 21:49, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

I have personally noticed significant moodiness and "sappiness", a la susceptibility to sentimentality with higher consumption of soy. I don't know of any other variables that would have affected it. I can't speak for the rest though, such as "man boobs". 73.246.102.180 (talk) 13:43, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Something this article fails to mention

People that call others soy boys are usually huge advocates of milk drinking. Some even advocate GOMAD or gallon of milk a day. You know milk, the thing full of mammalian estrogen. - π 02:13, 18 August 2018 (UTC)

Evo Morales

It is ironic to see that these people have the same fears and the same intellectual level as Latin American caudillos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CESojDbIOgs ^{— Unsigned, by: 190.174.66.59 / talk / contribs}

Caveat

A lot of these studies are working with moderate amount of soy intake, so it still might not be safe to eat soy in huge amounts. (eg. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0892036201001970) A slight raise of estrogen wouldn't affect testosterone levels. However when raising your the oestrogen levels enough, eventually it will, there is enough evidence for that. Also that testosterone levels are not affected doesn't mean that the phyto-estrogens don't exerts there effects on the body. That doesn't have to be bad perse, obviously men need estrogen to function and if your levels are too low, you run into problems: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1206168 ^{— Unsigned, by: 158.127.228.252 / talk}