Talk:John F. Kennedy assassination conspiracy theory/Archive1

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Anyone

Anyone else find it interesting that of all the pages about conspiracy theories, this one is the least ridiculed of them all. I wonder what some of you folks think about all these conspiracy theories surrounding the assassination of JFK.

It's a hard one to ridicule because of all the crazy things involved with it. Quite a few unknowns. We never got a motive from Oswald because he was gunned down hours later, and the guy who shot him took it to his grave. We don't even know if he acted alone. --PitchBlackMind 23:48, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

The page does need some snarking up, but I find the obsession some people have with trying to tie their pet crank issues to a JFK assassination conspiracy more amusing than the idea of a conspiracy itself, which is entirely plausible and (I would argue) probable given all the unknowns. Secret Squirrel 23:50, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

I deffinatly think we don't have the full story behind it, but i doubt it is a crazy as a lot of people think it is--BenB (talk) 17:47, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

If (XYZ} stood up and said 'our organization/my relative etc done it', with cast iron proof what would the conspiracists do with all the time on their hands (apart from 'proving' that XYZ was part of a meta-conspiracy, involving Daleks, LAdy Di, the Borgias, the Illuminati (continue to taste)

Possible backlashes

The point is, for most of the theoretical backers/initiators - the payback on their involvement being discovered was likely to be 'negative in the extreme-to-elimination.'

Given that JFK's private activities (relationships, links with certain groups etc) were probably well known 'in certain circles', and an election was coming up, discrete pressure 'puppet on a string activity' would have been far more practical - and the negative payback far more limited.

There is also the case that there are too many suggestions (has anyone brought in 'aliens on the Moon trying to stop JFK's space program or timetravellers - apart from an episode of Quantum Leap)? Jackiespeel (talk) 22:43, 19 December 2009 (UTC)

The Man on the Grassy Knoll

Is actually a spillover from a alternative universe in which LHO was based at that point - and they have a 'Repository Man myth.' (SF possibility for development) Jackiespeel (talk) 15:17, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

NO! The Grassy Knoll assassin was Lucien Sarti!

Twin Peaks theory

In Twin Peaks there is much munching of doughnuts.

JFK in (West) Germany said 'Ich bin ein Berliner' - Berliner being a type of doughnut.

There is a connection between the two. 212.85.6.26 (talk) 18:36, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

Refutations

Can we please actually try to refute these theories? I know information about the event is limited, but surely we can organize the theories into major claims like the 9/11 conspiracy theory article. Mr. Anon (talk) 01:14, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Um, maybe because the possibility of a JFK assassination conspiracy isn't that easily refuted, unlike 9/11 truther idiocy? Secret Squirrel (talk) 00:32, 3 June 2012 (UTC)

There was an official investigation, no? Mr. Anon (talk) 01:53, 3 June 2012 (UTC)

Come back when you're at least 30, kid. By any chance did you used to edit here as CUR? Secret Squirrel (talk) 02:02, 3 June 2012 (UTC)

My point is there have been debunkings of these conspiracy theories, some of which can be seen here. Mr. Anon (talk) 02:10, 3 June 2012 (UTC)

So what. There are sites "debunking" evolution out there. Fact is, you have at least one official investigation which confirms the conspiracy. Those kind of conspiracy theories are not to be put in the same category as 9/11, chemtrails, FEMA camps etc. Meaning you can't treat them as already totally debunked. -- DasRationalpersone (Annoy me!) 12:20, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

There were two official investigations, contradicting each other. I kind of stick with Bill Hicks. -- DasRationalpersone (Annoy me!) 19:00, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

A joke

Q: How can we be sure the CIA did not assassinate Kennedy?

A: Well, he died, didn't he? --TheLateGatsby (talk) 13:54, 14 October 2012 (UTC)

I demand McAdams website to be removed

Many of you will know me, I am the man who has been trying to remove the site that defends the official version.

His website is full of errors, in fact there is enough evidence proving a conspiracy in the Kennedy assassination. http://www.mtgriffith.com/web_documents/vsmcadams.htm

“I'm tired of it, and I'm coming out with the truth. And I think it's important that people need to know who this man(Oswald) was,” --Judyth Vary Baker

"The facts are that we do not know who killed President Kennedy, that the Warren Commission named the wrong man as the assassin and never searched for the truth of the crime." -- Howard Roffman, Presumed Guilty ( 1976 ).

"Had Oswald lived to face a trial, with competent defense it would have been risky, at best, for the authorities to try to make the claim that the physical evidence conclusively linked Oswald to the Walker shooting." --Gerald D. McKnight, Breach of Trust ( 2005 ) pg. 58.

"The individual that I know as Lee Harvey Oswald I don't think had it in him to be a person capable of committing such a crime as murdering the President of the United States. I'll always believe that. The side I saw of him was a very kind and loving man, and that's the way I like to remember him." -- Buell Wesley Frazier.

Thanks, we'll get right on that. Hipocrite (talk) 17:03, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

If you do not know, it is on the page called A site which defends the "official" version, critiquing conspiracy theories.

Moved from Tech Support page

This discussion was moved here from RationalWiki:Technical support.

It is being unfair to me that there I am not allowed to place more links on the JFK page, why am I putting this on, you may ask? You see...It is for Jack Kennedy. For I'll refer you to one of my all-time favorite conspiracy quotes.

"It matters because we owe it to him to find out who killed him, for his actions during the Cuban missile crisis. Kennedy’s decision to blockade rather than invade almost certainly prevented a nuclear holocaust which would have cost the lives of literally millions of people. The radiation would also have had devastating effects on the world’s food stocks. Millions of people would have been left without non-toxic food to eat- and would have starved to death."^{— Unsigned, by: 92.15.136.110 / talk / contribs}

What part of "Technical support" you don't understand?--ZooGuard (talk) 14:24, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

Ya but what about all the 100 foot tall women that won't be created? Tmtoulouse (talk) 17:48, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

FFS, whether Kennedy was a good president or not has nothing to do with whether there was a conspiracy to kill him. Personally I think he was rather a shitty president, and I think Johnson did a better job than JFK would have, but that makes no difference whatsoever to anything. As someone who has evolved very slowly to the lone nut theory, I can certainly understand why you want to reference your theories, but appeals to emotion are going to have the opposite effect of what you want. I suggest you make an account and post all your thoughts on the subject in an essay. If you are somewhat coherent then I'm sure plenty will debate it with you (for a while - not forever). Damo^Hi 21:22, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

JFK was a bigger man than you will ever be. Show some respect. ^{— Unsigned, by: 92.15.130.186 / talk / contribs}

I need help, someone made a bad comment about John F. Kennedy. And also Brendigg swore at me.

There is no need for swearing here! ^{— Unsigned, by: 92.15.130.186 / talk / contribs}

People say things all the time that we may disagree with (or strongly and unequivocally hate) . That's part of life and free speech. However, it is the general practice of this Wiki to not remove comments we don't like or disagree with unless those comments are utterly filled with spite and venom geared at somebody here (i.e: You are a selfish bitch who needs to jump off a bridge and die lonely). Brendigg has apologized on your talkpage, and I don't think any further worry is needed there. Reckless Noise Symphony (talk) 12:52, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

I was aware that JFK fanbois existed but this is my first experience with one of them personally. Mighty touchy isn't he/she? --Damo^Hi 23:13, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

I know one IRL, very touchy. Always rambles about the "New Orleans Connection". Humorless fascist^sociopath 01:08, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

The reasons against the conspiracy

1) Some variant on 'You are coming up for re-election - you do this or you lose election funding.'/'You slept with xxx and yyy, who slept with zzz - do as we say or ...'/What do you want your legacy to be?' The penalty for 'blackmail revealed' will be far less than 'assassinating the president' (even if it wasn't a federal crime at the time). 2) Sir Humphrey Appleby's relatives. 3) Some 50 years after the event there are some 50 conspiracies and counting rather than fewer. 4) Insufficient motives for assassinating the president ( with The Princes in the Tower the various candidates - Richard III, Duke of Buckingham and Henry VII gained signficantly from 'the true heirs; being out of the way permanently.)

The main problem is LHO did not leave an explanation 'of some sort.' (even of 'the tin foil hat made me do it' variety). 171.33.222.26 (talk) 18:58, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Meth is a powerful drug. Wèàšèìòìď^{Methinks it is a Weasel} 19:31, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

The purple liquid? 171.33.222.26 (talk) 15:04, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Sir HA - the conniving civil servant from Yes (Prime) Minister.

The bullets

... actually follow a straight line in multidimensional space.

The whole story involves [1], [2] and [3] - and possibly a [4]. 171.33.222.26 (talk) 18:52, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

Another possibility

The aliens on the moon did it - to stop them pesky humans from discovering them. 86.145.120.195 (talk) 22:11, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

No the moon is an optical illusion created by covert satellite technology. Athlete's foot is caused by the jews! Burkean (talk) 16:32, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

Magic Bullet Paragraph

The "magic bullet" paragraph is confusing and appears erroneous. Kennedy was sitting in the back of the car and Connally was in front of him. If whomever wrote it meant to say Kennedy was first in the path of the bullet in relation to Connally it should be more clear. ~ Unsigned by Ggregd

Hmm, this does seem a bit garbled. Is that section supposed to be talking about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-bullet_theory or something else? Lightning Dust (talk) 23:28, 19 February 2016 (UTC)

Ordinarily

I would probably agree with rationalwiki on this one. Most of the information offered up for a conspiracy doesn't really grab me. However, the fact that ferrie was very anti-castro and basically took the birch line on Kennedy, and knew Oswald through being a pilot and was a runner and part of a CIA project and that Bannister was a right wing activist and that he and Oswald had an association with Bannister is a tad askew. And why would Bannister, an ardent anti-communist, be around a supposedly Communist Lee Harvey Oswald? Not to mention that Ferrie and Bannister worked for Marcello who knew Sam G. And what were in those files Bannister was so paranoid about? Why would Fair Play for Cuba leaflets be in his office? Were they part of some research he was doing about the opposition?Burkean (talk) 16:09, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

I blame Ruby...

If it weren't for Ruby offing Oswald, I personally think there would be a lot less conspiracy theories. That oft repeated "first rule of assassination: kill the assassin." unfortunately leads those that already favor seeing everything as a conspiracy down the rabbit hole. They see Ruby killing Oswald as part of the coverup. More likely they were both probably just nuts.

On and unrelated to my subject line, but related note on the article; there is a great documentary that came out a few years ago, where they focused on debunking the so called "magic bullet". I can't off hand recall the name, I will be doing a little google-fu later to see if I can pull up the right one. They methodically recreate the shooting using ballistic gelatin with inserts to simulate skeletons and shoot from the exact same distance from the same height. Much of the woo around the "magic bullet" relies on the fact that most people don't understand ballistics and that those of us who do have anecdotal understanding of ballistics, are more familiar with vastly different bullets (ballistic coefficient) that have a completely different terminal affect.B4Xiphos (talk) 09:18, 14 April 2016 (UTC)

Found the documentary: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-5xfTKqf1A it is called JFK: Beyond the Magic Bullet. Part of the Unsolved History series originally on Discovery Channel. B4Xiphos (talk) 09:30, 14 April 2016 (UTC)

War by any other means

If the Soviet or the Cuban governments had done it, it would have been treated as a blatant act of war - so onion domes/Havana splatted by nukes (with the full support of the PRC, Albania and the rest of the world).

Any non-state body would have been treated to a similar disproportionate response.

Anything against this? 31.49.137.204 (talk) 21:56, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

I mean, this implies that someone knew that the Soviets/Cubans/etc. did it -- which is doubtful -- and so this isn't really useful either way. :/ Sir ℱ℧ℤℤϒℂᗩℑᑭƠℑᗩℑƠ (talk/stalk) 22:18, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

And what about the 'Will nobody get rid of this turbulent priest' theory - someone suggests 'things would be a whole lot better if someone dealt with that (words of choice) in the White House' and/or some variant of [5]. 82.44.143.26 (talk) 19:31, 21 November 2016 (UTC)

I think the point being made was meant to be 'if X did it and it became known, then...' 82.44.143.26 (talk) 17:26, 4 January 2017 (UTC)

Car seats, and Connelly

I read somewhere that some of the seats in the car were raised above the others (which would affect where the bullet went).

There is a theory that LHO was after John Connelly - JFK was collateral damage. 86.191.125.249 (talk) 10:52, 5 December 2016 (UTC)